Jump to content


Photo

new complications with magic tournaments


  • Please log in to reply
9 replies to this topic

#1 Opperation Human Sheild

Opperation Human Sheild

    Noob

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 15 posts

Posted 14 September 2011 - 04:23 PM

before i say anything you must know that i am have no power contrived or otherwise over these tournaments i do not even play magic im just relaying a message that could provide a headache for the club, its members and magic players. Secondly this may not be in effect as the problem arose with Greek letter fraternities and while i am biased as a member of one (im convinced Administration hates us) this may not apply to a club, reguardlessly i do not want the club slapped with a pointless fine or worse be forced to disband, a recent change to the student code of conduct (http://www.wcu.edu/24861.asp for reference) has been recently amended putting more of a strain on games of chance (if you believe magic is a game of chance or not the school thinks it is and they sadly own our asses) which in my case made poker nights illegal. and since it was added to the student code of conduct (a over breaching document that supersedes all club bi-laws) trying to sneak this buy would be a very risking thing not just as a member of the club but as a student at western (as infraction can mean expulsion).

now im not implying that we should not hold magic tournaments but i'm bringing to the attention of anyone devoted enough to magic to read the forum to allow you time to appeal the school or apply for exemption or what ever you might need to do to make the tournament happen.

if you need anything else or help dealing with whatever office of the school please let me know

For an official ruling it would be best to contact Mike Corielli (associate director of the UC corelli@email.wcu.edu) or Walt Turner (Direction of Student Judical wturner@email.wcu.edu)

Edited by Opperation Human Sheild, 14 September 2011 - 04:28 PM.

ΣX KΓ AO BAM #274

#2 MasterP

MasterP

    Gaming Club Adviser

  • Club Advisers
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7320 posts

Posted 14 September 2011 - 05:04 PM

Old news:

Sometimes when people think your idea is bad it's not because they're an asshole or don't like you, sometimes it really is a bad idea. Depending on how you approach an MTG tournament it could be considered gambling on state property which nets the entire exec staff (and you) misdemeanor charges, expulsion from WCU, and gets the gaming club banned from operating in the state of NC.

When we tried to tell you guys how risky card games are we were trolled into oblivion <_<

I would bypass Mike Corelli and go straight to Walt Turner. He's the one that would be in charge of any judicial proceedings brought against students participating in this or the club for hosting it were a tournament found to be in violation of school or state law. His response should be the only one considered final on this subject. Don't email him, go sit down in his office and talk to him. On paper MTG is a violation of the "game of chance" laws, in practice not so much. See if he'll work with you, he probably will, but I'm telling you right now if you give out cash prizes or gift cards you will not get permission to play this at the LANs. You need SWAG or physical objects such as boosters to have any chance of getting his blessing.
Mitch/MasterP/Kip

Posted Image

#3 melatonin

melatonin

    (Evil) Secretary

  • Club Executives
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 443 posts

Posted 14 September 2011 - 05:44 PM

I talked to DSCE about this last year, and from what they said was we could have prizes or an entry, but not both, which really boils down to removing the incentive for either the club to hold one a MTG tournament or people to attend said tournament. However, we did have one club sponsored MTG tournament last year with free entry fee and donated (by individuals, not the club) prizes. I feel the DSCE is incorrect in labeling MTG a game of chance, and the lack of legal restrictions on companies and stores who run events like these prove it. It's really a shame that the club can't hold MTG tournaments, because the club could make a profit while players would have lower entrance fees than they would at hobby stores (I've crunched the numbers on this). Additionally, I know many students who are interested in on-campus MTG tournaments.

I plan on talking to them again this semester about the issue. I don't know how relevant this is to poker players, but if you have any questions or comments on the issue, PM me.

Posted Image
Posted Image

Wii Council Leader
HAHAHA DISREGARD THAT

Secretary

Tunnel Snakes Rule!


#4 MasterP

MasterP

    Gaming Club Adviser

  • Club Advisers
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7320 posts

Posted 14 September 2011 - 07:35 PM

One thing you might look at doing is having the club host MTG events seperate from the LAN events and have no entry fee but do have a physical object prize, like boosters. I know you've done this already with donated prizes but hear me out. This may cost the club money but you could offset that by having a freeplay MTG tournament at the LAN with the prize being a first round bye at a MTG event or some such. Such a system would encourage MTG players to come to the LAN, where they DO pay to enter, but since they'd be playing other games as well, which isn't against school policy, the money you make off them is legit on the books. That money should easily offset the cost of prizes at seperate MTG events.
Mitch/MasterP/Kip

Posted Image

#5 Phonetically Phamous (dice

Phonetically Phamous (dice

    Legendary Noob

  • Root Admin
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7747 posts

Posted 14 September 2011 - 07:57 PM

Old news:

Sometimes when people think your idea is bad it's not because they're an asshole or don't like you, sometimes it really is a bad idea. Depending on how you approach an MTG tournament it could be considered gambling on state property which nets the entire exec staff (and you) misdemeanor charges, expulsion from WCU, and gets the gaming club banned from operating in the state of NC.

When we tried to tell you guys how risky card games are we were trolled into oblivion <_<

luz good day sir

#6 melatonin

melatonin

    (Evil) Secretary

  • Club Executives
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 443 posts

Posted 14 September 2011 - 09:15 PM

One thing you might look at doing is having the club host MTG events seperate from the LAN events and have no entry fee but do have a physical object prize, like boosters. I know you've done this already with donated prizes but hear me out. This may cost the club money but you could offset that by having a freeplay MTG tournament at the LAN with the prize being a first round bye at a MTG event or some such. Such a system would encourage MTG players to come to the LAN, where they DO pay to enter, but since they'd be playing other games as well, which isn't against school policy, the money you make off them is legit on the books. That money should easily offset the cost of prizes at seperate MTG events.

Interesting idea. I'll think up some logistics for this and bounce the idea with some execs.

Posted Image
Posted Image

Wii Council Leader
HAHAHA DISREGARD THAT

Secretary

Tunnel Snakes Rule!


#7 Thor

Thor

    President

  • Club Executives
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 395 posts

Posted 15 September 2011 - 10:45 AM

The whole thing was that you dont know what the next card being drawn is so thats what made it a game of chance, and the only way to bypass this would to play with the top card reavealed at all times. But really like the idea Mitch since a first round bye would not be considered a monetary prize
"Total slaughter. Total slaughter. I won't leave a single man alive. La di da de die, Genocide. La di da de dud, An ocean of blood. Let's begin the killing time."

#8 Opperation Human Sheild

Opperation Human Sheild

    Noob

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 15 posts

Posted 16 September 2011 - 01:47 PM

I talked to DSCE about this last year, and from what they said was we could have prizes or an entry, but not both, which really boils down to removing the incentive for either the club to hold one a MTG tournament or people to attend said tournament. However, we did have one club sponsored MTG tournament last year with free entry fee and donated (by individuals, not the club) prizes. I feel the DSCE is incorrect in labeling MTG a game of chance, and the lack of legal restrictions on companies and stores who run events like these prove it. It's really a shame that the club can't hold MTG tournaments, because the club could make a profit while players would have lower entrance fees than they would at hobby stores (I've crunched the numbers on this). Additionally, I know many students who are interested in on-campus MTG tournaments.

I plan on talking to them again this semester about the issue. I don't know how relevant this is to poker players, but if you have any questions or comments on the issue, PM me.


the problem is they literally changed the ruling on August 11th of this year so the regulations are new, bypassing Corelli in my opinion is just a bad idea while he doesn't have Walt's jurisdiction A he is in charge of the UC so stepping on the toes of the guy of the guy who lets us hold the Lan is a bad idea not to mention from talking to him about this (yet again for a rush biased poker tournament) and he honestly found this rule to be asinine while he may not have the power of Walt Turner but if there is someone with in the administration that dislikes this ruling and that has the clout and ability to raise argument against it with in the official channels
ΣX KΓ AO BAM #274

#9 MasterP

MasterP

    Gaming Club Adviser

  • Club Advisers
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7320 posts

Posted 16 September 2011 - 02:46 PM

Mike doesn't have the authority to override or contest this rule. No matter how dumb he may find it, it's very unlikely he'll attempt to intervene on our behalf because of the possible political fallout involved. Everything at WCU is political and getting on the wrong side of something, anything, isn't wise. When it comes to student rules and affairs, how close you are to Keith Corzine's office in Scott is typically the indicator as to how much of a power you have to change things. Mike is in the UC, Walter is like 3 doors down from Keith.

Trust me, he's not going to get upset that you skipped him. This is a judicial affairs issue and is something he knows he has no say on. In fact, if you go there and get something he feels is stupid changed, without asking him to get involved at all, the initiative may actually garner more respect from him. Then again it could also spark some jealousy that we have more sway in Scott 1st than he does. Either way, don't think for one second that he has the authority to prevent you from hosting LAN events in the UC. All clubs at WCU are entitled to host events where ever they please and any problems he throws in your way would be easily dealt with by Keith.

Talk to Mike if you feel you must, but the real change will occur when you talk to Walter. You may even have to play your ace in the hole (Keith) but I would only do that as an absolute last resort.
Mitch/MasterP/Kip

Posted Image

#10 Thor

Thor

    President

  • Club Executives
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 395 posts

Posted 18 September 2011 - 12:49 AM

Just from previous exp anyhow when we talked to Mike last year, he called Walt to get verification. So might as well get a face to face with Walt then have him coming over the speakerphone.
"Total slaughter. Total slaughter. I won't leave a single man alive. La di da de die, Genocide. La di da de dud, An ocean of blood. Let's begin the killing time."




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users